With everyone trying to move away from Amazon’s associates or at least trying To diversify away from it Affiliate networks are one of the first Options that pops in everyone’s minds Because it’s so convenient to have all The offers under one dashboard and have One source of payment etc But our affiliate networks really was Your time what are the things that you Need to avoid or at least be careful When you’re using them Or how do you solve dilemmas like for Example if you want to promote a pair of Nike shoes that is both available On amazon and on an affiliate network Like cj which one should you use in Which case etc These are the kind of questions that we Are going to attempt to answer to In this episode so stay tuned [Music] Hi everyone welcome back to the atari Hacker podcast so the other day i was Looking at the podcast feed and i was Looking for ideas for the podcast And i realized that in more than 250 Episodes we never talked About affiliate networks on their own uh When they’re a pretty important part of The way we monetize things It’s not necessarily my favorite i tend To prefer more individual networks as we Will talk about in this episode
Um not individual individual affiliate Programs not networks Um and i explain why in this episode but It’s going to be interesting so Because it’s such an important part of Monetization with that we would cover it And cover our experience with them So that you guys know exactly how to use Networks so that you can monetize your Sites better So for that obviously i have mark so How’s it going mark It’s going good gail how are you i uh You know someone commented Uh on the premiere last week uh why i Was asking why Only one of us was wearing an otto Hacker t-shirt or thing because it’s Always you right Yeah just can’t be bothered usually to Change and my answer was budget we can’t Afford both but I could have fought the old one right This is the old logo because i still Needn’t receive the new ones I actually i actually have the new ones Uh downstairs i I’ve just been too lazy to box them up And send them over to you so Apologies for that i do have one Interesting how’s it going mark story Though So i was actually the guest on another Podcast this week and the guy
Asked me after introducing me how’s it Going mark And i just i froze like i didn’t have an Answer prepared And i was like uh good i guess Uh so it seems like your how’s it going Mark thing has started to spread And to be honest conditioning i’m Getting a little worried now It’s like your brain snaps when it Happens you know it’s like uh It’s a post-traumatic experience and you Get something that just uh Flashes back in your head and you break You know that’s pretty funny uh Okay let’s talk about third networks um And I i usually tend to let you do the Intros first parts of the podcast Because i think you’re clearer than me When you explain Um what things are and how they are so I’ll let you do that part as well which Is just What is an actual effort network and how Does it work An affiliate network is a company which Brings together Affiliate tracking software often Payment software Payment processing as well as A group of vendors that is people who Have products and who are looking For affiliates and a group of affiliates
Who are looking to promote products and When you have all three of those pieces Under one roof it creates a pretty Strong value proposition For uh an affiliate so you can join that Program that Network and you can instantly get access To Promote dozens or hundreds of thousands Even of different products and different Vendors Uh all using the same link technology or Link generation software One login one payout details uh one One payout payment uh so it just keeps Things Easy as an affiliate as a vendor or Someone with a product You can go to them and you will have Access to their technology but also They’ll be there to help you set up Maybe give you some advice As well as their affiliate managers will Or can assist In getting affiliates to push your Product so Making them aware that it exists this is In stark Contrast to running your own affiliate Program which is still possible and Pretty easy from a technology Perspective a lot of shopping carts These days will have Uh the affiliate tracking software uh
Built in And it will connect to paypal or Whatever payment processor That’s how we do on the toyota right Yeah so we use a thrive cart To process payments for our courses on Authority hacker and they have a Built-in Affiliate tracking software in there uh So That’s what that’s what we use now the Downside of that is that we have to go Out and find our own Affiliates and we have to create our own Affiliate onboarding Process and application form and screen Them and Um and do all these things which means That It’s a little bit i guess trick A little bit more tricky sometimes to to To find affiliates than it would be just Going to a big network But there are some advantages i.e more Control It’s cheaper to run it yourself uh you Can kind of Customize things and set set up things To the way you want to And some of the i don’t know nefarious Policies that that Uh affiliate networks sometimes have um You don’t have to deal with their basically
Yeah it’s kind of like well do you want To manage this or do you want to Take this off your company but you know What it’s why it’s really important for Me it’s not just like As a like a lot of people are going to Be like shaking their heads they’re like You don’t care as an athlete but you do Care Um because and that’s one of the reasons Why i prefer Independent affiliate programs because You’re talking as a vendor or as an Affiliate here though As an affiliate um and the reason why is Because a company that decides to put The resources behind properly running Their Programs versus using a network tends to Just care more about that program And usually see the return for that Which is an indication to me that They’re making money with the fa program Um whereas you know running through A network feels more like a second Thought like kind of like when you Outsource something versus when you do It yourself right You you tend to focus on doing the Things yourself that bring the most Value and outsourcing the stuff that’s Like secondary to your business And so that’s that’s my opinion that It’s like the way it works is like
People who are network stand tend to see This as secondary Whereas people who run their own Affiliate programs tend to see this as a Primary method of acquiring traffic and Monetization And you’re more likely to get quality From the people who run their Own fa program however it could also be The other end it could literally be Scammers running a trap affiliate Program taking your traffic and never Paying you out which We should talk about a little bit later Maybe um so i just wanted to highlight That because i think it’s something that People will You know bypass and be like that’s a Useless detail but it’s actually In my experience it matters quite a bit And it tells you the philosophy of the Company towards the fa program And and just to sort of like turn that Around a little bit There are some good examples of like Niche specific Affiliate programs so you have your General um Sorry affiliate networks you have your General affiliate networks you know your Commission junction Share a cell affiliate window those Those kind of guys Then you have a lot of niche-specific
Affiliate networks i’m thinking more Niche when we met those guys out when We’re at the The chiang mai seo conference a couple Years back And they focused primarily on kind of Health and diet and supplement Kind of ranges i i think at least So by going by going into them and Like applying for them you can get Access to like a lot of programs Um quite quickly and you can kind of con Compare them all Easily and yeah just kind of get Involved you know to fill out Dozens of affiliate applications and Then wait to be approved and It depends right it’s like when you work Within an affiliate network When you just especially like this is More like smaller networks You tend to there’s tears of affiliates Right there’s like kind of like You know it’s gonna be like playing a Ranked overwatch right you’re like Silver Gold platinum etc uh think about it that Way And um depending on your tier you get Access you don’t get access to all the Offers when you join enough Networks it’s quite often that you Arrive and then you see a bunch of Offers in the dashboard but actually
You’re gonna For many offers you’re gonna need to Still apply within the network right so It’s often easy to get in the network But you don’t necessarily you can not Necessarily promote everything and for Big networks like cj and Cell for most programs you need to apply Right you need to go ahead and fill Another application That is then reviewed by the company so When you sign up for the network you’re Signing up to the network that decides If you as an effort are interested for The network but A lot and increasingly more offers will Require a second application Within the network where you get another Phone to fill and that application is Going to be reviewed by the company that Is running through the network And then be approved or not approved and Very often In my experience i’ve applied to a bunch Of things through that and I get no reply and the only way to get a Reply is to Talk to your affiliate managers through The network so they can then nudge the Person in the company So i will then look at your application And eventually you might get in you know This is a common Common problem not just with networks
But when applying for affiliate programs Is You don’t get a reply it’s like did they Reject me did they Not get it is there some technical Problem or have they just not Checked it recently and trying to figure Out what’s going on there’s is difficult As you said though with an affiliate Network you have An account manager an affiliate manager Who You have their contact info a lot of the Time you’ll have spoken to them on a Skype call or something And you’ll be able to reach out to them And say hey you know What’s going on here and they can reach Out to the right people grease the Wheels and kind of Get you in as it were also the better Networks You know you apply once and know for the Network and then They’ll pull a lot of that data so your Application to each program within the Network Is much shorter so you don’t have to Type in your email address in your Business Vap number and all those kind of Details that they they seem to need These these days it’s more just like A few specific things to specific that
That affiliate program Yeah um but it can also be quite Frustrating it also happens that you Have to redo the same thing Uh a million times et cetera so um i Think i think It’s almost just in general with Affiliate programs and affiliate Networks I really feel the pain of affiliate Managers and i understand why this this Happens because 90 to 95 of people of affiliates that Join Uh will refer no traffic and make no Sales like they join with the best Intentions Um but for whatever reason they don’t Follow through and They don’t do anything so there’s a lot Of burden um Administrative burden like dealing with Those people um And you know when you have loads of Accounts and you need to like change Something you need to reach out to Everyone and Just gets a little bit messy so i Understand why networks and programs are Trying to Throttle the number of people coming in They all they want to Not have that 19 to 95 get in and just Have like the people who are actually
Serious Um in there and so that’s why i think They apply Directly or indirectly through you know Not responding to applications Often i think that’s why they they’re They’re poor in Accepting people um like that yeah it’s Not just that it’s also If you think about what i said earlier If the affiliate program is more of a Token Second thought like kind of like the People in the in the parent company Uh think that the affiliate network is Managing that or like there’s someone That’s doing this on the side of their Job because they’re just merging the Network then they they’re less on the Ball when they Receive a direct applications that they Need to approve inside the company that Is running through the network Um and it feels like yeah like to my Experience so in a lot of cases they Mostly reply to the nudges of the update Manager and we should talk about the Affect manager Who it is what they do and what to do at The beginning like You do that more so you should talk like You’re the one who talks to them usually I know who makes the strategy and then You’re just like okay fine we need to
This network And you go talk to them and then you Just negotiate a better deal or whatever You do I always see so around like applying to Networks and programs like i always see It as a challenge i’m expecting to be Sort of Ghosted the first time we apply Especially as a new site i’m thinking Maybe they Often the application form doesn’t have Enough fields for you to explain Who you are or what you’re really trying To do it’s just like name website Chosen strategy or whatever and you Select it from a drop down and it’s like It’s not really real really effective in Me communicating my message But in 100 of time of of times when We’ve applied for an app for a affiliate Program or network And we’ve wanted to get in and they Haven’t responded I’ve been able to find a way to get in Touch with them and being able to craft A message that convinces them that they Should let us in 100 of times um and just the mere fact Of going through those motions and and Show expressing your interest in a more Sincere way to the right person Tracking down that person as you would For you know link building outreach or
Something it’s really not that different Then you can almost always get in as i Said so Yeah yeah um but like i was most Thinking about the affiliate like You get some kind of like as a signed Effect manager when you join a network Right you get someone that’s assigned to You usually you see in the dashboard When you log in et cetera Would you contact them right away uh and What happens with them Uh often no uh especially for new sites Like Often we’ll sign up for an affiliate Network for a new site Which doesn’t have much traffic or Realistically we’re probably not going To make any sales Because we’re focusing on seo we’re not Going to make any sales for Several months and so it’s it’s only After we’ve started to deliver something That i’ll i’ll reach out and Um and try and spark that that Relationship obviously if they reach out To me i’ll Engage i’ll set up a call um if if They’re up for that But often though they’re like wow we’ll Wait till see If their numbers kind of go up before It’s worth worth reaching out to To the site so i think yeah that’s
That would generally be my approach but Once we have Started sending some traffic start Sending uh making some commissions Um i think reaching out and engaging With the affiliate manager and Treating them nice is So important uh and having been on both Sides of this Uh as a vendor and as an affiliate I know that the vast majority of Affiliates Do not treat the affiliate managers very Well at All um and you get a lot of Very um short robotic Um kind of rc um Messages to to them saying like why is This happening or what’s this like no Attempt to engage them on a personal Level Which i think is a mistake um and i Think we’ve seen From past experience that building that Relationship and And getting to to know affiliate Managers has paid dividends and The vast majority of cases when we’ve Really put in the effort to To talk to them or you know even Sometimes like go and visit them in Their In their offices if we happen to be um Near
Near where they’re at yeah i think um i Think It’s it’s important to be nice it’s also Important to not give information you Don’t have to give Um a lot of these affiliate managers are Also athletes Um it’s like just just having that kind Of job makes them Like like oh my god this guy’s making 10k months or whatever like i want to do That too Um and and and it’s really really not Uncommon that An affiliate like someone that works for The network or for whatever offer you’re Promoting for that matter Um you you talk to them and you like Having a discussion maybe trying to Increase your commissions maybe showing Them something whatever And and they they create sites that Would literally copy you as well so They’re potential competitors as well And and you they might even be computers Before they talk to you right they might Already have sites Promoting x offer whatever and so you Need to be A little careful and i would not give Information i don’t need to give And and when i can stay vague I would stay vague you know it’s like i Would necessarily
Like if i show an example of a page i Would not show my best page i would not Like you can you can hide that like even When you clock your links etc it’s much Harder for them because they see them The redirect you know they don’t see Which page it comes from or something Like this so They don’t have all the data and uh and That’s actually an important point about Link cloaking because by default the Affiliate program will give you Uh an affiliate link generator usually That you can Um create an affiliate link and just Kind of stick it on your Your site somewhere but if you just do That they’ll see Exactly where all the clicks and all the Sales come from so the affiliate manager Will have full transparency over Which pages on your site are making the Sales so if you start like a new content Hub that does particularly well They’ll see it and often they’ll pass That Information on you know if it’s their Own project or they’re working on or to Other affiliates You know maybe there’s there’s no Competition and you found a new Group of seed keywords that are working Really well but the affiliates manager Is interested to get as many people
Making sales for their product yeah so He would give it to them So hey this is working really well for Them why don’t you do the same as well Yeah Uh and that’s that works in their their Interest there’s another thing uh It’s like if i was in a really Competitive niche like if i was in like Casino finance Even travel things like that i would not Even cloak my links on my main domains i Would clock my links on a third-party Domain Um you can use tools like click magic For example like it’s a better Bit of a better uh affiliate tracker if You if you it’s it’s more expensive but You can do that and and this way they Wouldn’t even necessarily See my main domain or if you have Multiple sites in the same niche for Example you know you can register with One site But kind of like also push traffic from Other sites and if you have a third Party tracking domain then Uh they won’t necessarily see even the Site so they can’t just find it and put It in ahrefs or something like this and You can You can hide that by having just a Dedicated domain that’s here to just Redirect the traffic
So you send your traffic to i don’t know I’ll say it’s like uh Autohacker.net let’s imagine we have the Toyhacker.net as a tracking domain for a Finance site Um i would use that as my cloak links And it would send traffic to a Toyota.net which was then redirect to The fa offer And they would never see would the Origin site you know and especially if You have a network of sites if you have Like some sites that Are really banking et cetera it might be Worth registering with one And and sending traffic with the rest of Your site You should probably say in your in your Application that you have a network of Sites but you shouldn’t necessarily give All the urls Um so that you’re clear but you also Want to protect your information because You are talking to people that that Could potentially use that information Against you as well so Something i’d be quite careful another Thing i’d be a bit careful is um Taking anything these managers say for Granted Um because as part of their job they are Giving Given objectives right essentially their Job is to be the salesman
Of a given author let’s say that the Network that they’re working for Just made a deal with a big a big weight Loss company And they promised to try to push you Know 200 000 Of sales per month to these guys right The The affiliate manager is largely Incentivized to oversell that offer to You And make you push traffic to these People even though that may not be the Best course of action for you as an Affiliate Because of the engagement the network Has taken because they want to grow that Relationship for themselves etc and so I’d be a little careful when something Is a little bit overhyped and they’re Telling oh it’s working so well for like 10 other people etc To not take this at face value and uh And and bring a lot of skepticism when They’re pushing something to you Because you’re a product to them you’re Essentially a traffic source And they just need to convince you it’s Uh it’s it’s just typical Business deals that i renew lose Sometimes not necessarily that it Doesn’t mean everything they say is bad But You have to understand what is what
They’re trying to achieve Uh with talking to you which is making You send the right traffic to the right Place for them to make the most money Not you making the most money and so Yeah i don’t know if that happened to You when you talk to them sometimes but It’s You know it’s like some of them are a Bit happy basically but yeah all the Time all the time yeah I mean if you were to just do everything Every affiliate manager said you would Be changing everything All the time and you’d never like get Anywhere so yeah You have to have a layer of critical Sense applied to Anything they’re they’re kind of asking You for that doesn’t mean that Everything they’re they’re saying is Is because actually sometimes They’ll come along with like a Legitimately good Good offer or indeed they may be some Saying something that works really well For 10 other sites but Because yours is the content is Different or the angle is a little bit Different it might just not work for Yours because Your audience is different so it’s hard To hard to say whether there’s like Nefarious undertones to to the intent or
Not Yeah uh usually usually what you what i Do If that let’s say let’s say an effect Manager would push something to me Um i made that video right about um Finding Other sites promoting stuff through the Tracking links right so you can put the Tracking links into ahrefs And you can so you can take your Tracking for given offer put in hrefs And find your competitors that are Pushing the same offer right and it’s Like Kind of like try to fact check what They’re saying you know it’s like hey Are really a lot of people pushing that Stuff can i see that when i actually Reverse engineer Uh competition for the offer um or is This something that’s completely new Nobody’s pushing And they’re just trying to just grow it And they’re trying to use me as a guinea Pig you know Um so yeah i would i would Double check stuff i would probably stay Nice on the call you know Try to like call them out and ruin the Relationship or something like this but Be like hey i’ll think about it and then I would double check And if that’s interesting then i’ll get
Back in touch with them and if it’s not Interesting i’d just pretend i forgot About it That’s pretty much how we manage that Relationship so Yeah be be a little careful of these People they have Their best interest in mind but Sometimes and Even often your interest and their Interest aligns because the more sales You make the more money they make as Well Um anything else on managers uh Just to get back to your like link Cloaking thing um i i don’t want Everyone listening to this thinking oh i need to go away and cloak all my Affiliate links right now Like this yes i mean certainly not for Something like amazon but This is quite common where there are Affiliates who are sending paid traffic To To an offer uh because anyone else can Come along and just buy that same or Similar Paid traffic if they know where it’s Where it’s coming from so Link cloaking and all that’s like really Big and really important when you’re Doing something like that It’s slightly more challenging it’s a Lot more challenging in fact to
Replicate a website especially if it has Any kind of authority or it’s Established um you can’t just throw Another blog up and target the same Keywords and rewrite them some people Will some people will try and Occasionally people will have some some Success but it’s not That big of a deal that you you need to Go away and cloak all of your links Right away yeah i would only do it if You’re going like finance or something Really really competitive At like where people have sharp teeth You know and they’re very Experienced as well yeah this i think This happens a lot with like uh Weight loss and supplements as well like I remember from our our health site days Um we didn’t get into that too much but Yeah there were some there were some Iffy things going on for sure With uh with some of those networks um What i will say as well is that a lot of Networks have The ability to create tracking ids so You you’ll let’s say create a tracking Id per Post on your site and then you you put Those in um Just remember that if you make those Obvious or that they’re the same as the Url You’re cloaking it then they’re still
Going to have that tracking id data so You might need to create some kind of Coded tracking ids and then have a Reference sheet where you can like do a Vlookup and And map it back if if you really want to Get into that but I do want to emphasize for 90 plus Percent people of people listening to This that’s Really not a concern we don’t do that For any of our websites at the moment so Not currently yeah Um so some of the previous ones i would Have the like I i would die but yeah we need to get Like a tin foil you know and when we get Stuff like that we just need to like Start wearing it so people know Uh if that’s what you want us to do just Drop it in the comments on youtube Let us know if we need to make homemade Synthetic i love it I i know i know it’s okay i’m really Tired it’s usually when i get my best Ideas you know Um anyway let’s talk um i want to talk About stats within effect networks Because it Kind of crosses over with the affiliate Managers Um in the sense that let’s be Like i don’t always believe the stats I see in affiliate network so first of
All they all kind of like have their own Stats Some of them are pretty common so you Know if you’re going character or cj for Example They get like epc um but like normally You know when you do epc with ads for Example you it’s like earning per click That’s how you would call It for for them first of all it’s Earning per 100 clicks Which means that already you’re reading This a bit differently but it’s it’s Kind of tricky in the sense that if you Believe that then it’s looking like very Inflated numbers which They may not be they’re just they’re Just like they actually use a different Definition for it but I find it fishy unless you go find it in Their health files it doesn’t say that But if you run a ppc campaign epc you’ll Say Uh per click right and um For a network like clickbank for example You get gravity your Gravity is a number that kind of make up Through a custom algorithm that is Based on the number of affiliates that Made money with that Made a sell with that offer within the Last 12 weeks for example so that’s the Kind of weird metrics you get so The first thing you need to do when you
Get into a network is look at you know Open the dashboard with all the offers And you get like three four five matrix For each offer And go on the help file and read what Each metric Actually is according to them and they Will be Deceiving like the epc thing for example They will do that so that it looks like You’re making a ton of money sending um Selling traffic to an offer but really Just multiplied the the proper epc by 100 Um and uh and that’s that’s why Sometimes it looks ridiculous you see Offers with like 300 epc etc no it’s actually three Dollar per click which Would make sense for a good offer it’s Possible um So you need to be a bit careful with That and another thing is Um the numbers you see in the dashboard It’s not it’s it’s very rarely what You’re going to see when you promote the Offer Uh first of all because it’s essentially Taking all the traffic so if you have Affiliates that have very very high Intent traffic for example they will do Very well so let’s say you well let’s Just take bluehost like the people They’re not the guy who ranks number one
For bluehost review His epc is gonna be really high right But if you rank for Um how to make side income and then you Link to bluehost In the subsection on making a blog right The intent is going to be much lower and The epc is going to be much lower and It’s going to be like this for you There’s going to be a mix of that in That number and nobody really has that Number you see it’s just the average of Like Different people that send traffic so You need to be a bit careful and i I have no proof but i often believe that These numbers are skewed a little bit as Well towards what the offers that the Network wants to push Um so that it looks good to you like the Numbers look high and then you Go ahead and push that offer because That’s the one the network maybe makes The most margin on Something like this and so you need to Be a little careful with all these Numbers in the dashboard There’s my favorite way of there’s some Other tricks that they’ll they’ll do as Well so you’ll like you can order it and Like sort it by epc But then rather than having the best Ones at the top they’ll do like some Featured ones which oh yeah they’re
Preferred yeah Essentially internal ads they’ll pay for Them obviously but they they’ll Enable the network to push the products Which they get the highest yeah it’s Drama it’s a little deceiving you know Like It’s like it’s the whole thing is a Little deceiving and it’s like you Shouldn’t trust 100 what you’re seeing On your screen Um my favorite way of validating an Offer is really to Get a tracking link put in hrefs and see A bunch of people promoting the offer Ranking for good keywords And and even better if people are Actively creating content that promotes Our offer like if Today because it’s very frequent as well The offers did well at some point uh Like for example you could find some Some some clickbank products on On health ambition that we promoted that Made us really quite good money at the Time but like Really they make zero today um and then It’s like you would reverse engineer be Like oh i’m gonna promote that offer It’s gonna be great I’m telling you you’re wasting your time Right even though you’re gonna do Reverse engineering that site You’re gonna make no money um and so
It’s even better if the content was Refreshed Or created recently or they are you know Regularly creating content That promotes that offer in the last few Months so that would be What i’m looking for it will evade it And offer much more than the stats i see In the affiliate networks dashboard i Tend to just i mean i don’t think they Like i don’t think they would like Completely as well right i don’t think They would put a massive epc on Something that’s Making zero and i don’t think they put Zero on something that makes you a lot Of money so It’s kind of like keyword research right It’s like the so the number you see in The tools Is not really the realities just you can Compare them with each other And uh so i would do i would use that to Filter and after that i would do this Computer reverse engineering and i would Look At what people are actually doing in the Field and if people Are pushing this over then then that’s When i would say okay let’s go Let’s create some content let’s try a Small hub maybe five pages Uh and then see what happens in three Months and then if it worked well then
Let’s produce You know as many keywords as we can Basically um [Music] Anything on the on the stats no Okay um i wanted to like then go after Some dilemmas that really do exist in Real life Um because i think they’re quite Important so let’s say You have a running site a running Affiliate right and you want to promote Some nike issues You kind of have two options here right You can either promote people to amazon I don’t know how much they pay probably Three percent i’m gonna guess three Percent uh at this point Or you can promote them through cj that Has a nike fa program that let’s say Pays you four point five or five percent Let’s say let’s imagine right Um which one do you do and why [Music] I Yeah that’s a really good question I would i mean i’m going to take the seo You’d try it you’d try to say it depends I’ll test it etc etc My gut instinct says in that case Amazon’s probably going to be better Even though it’s three percent versus Four and a half because Of the cross selling that occurs on
Amazon and the The number of people who just buy other Other stuff and the conversion rate Being being logged in they have higher Prime all that stuff um with those Numbers being three to four and a half Percent i think It it’s probably not gonna be too much In it but it might lean towards amazon If it was three percent and ten percent Then i would For sure start with the the cj offer and And go Go go with that when was the last time You bought shoes on the makers shoes Website Um honestly like i’ve rarely but i don’t Think i’ve ever bought shoes on on Amazon I think i’ve only ever bought shoes Direct from from support Nike dark clothes like you’ve gone like Yeah i like I haven’t bought nike honestly i’m all About geox shoes these days i mean Here’s the problem like geox have such Good shoes that i haven’t actually Bought any shoes in four years because All mine still work fine so they last That long We’re like not sponsored honestly Honestly Buy giant shoes how is that helping the Podcast
But like legit i haven’t bought shoes in A long time so Okay well i mean yeah it’s like the Thing um I mean i i if it was for three to ten Percent yeah maybe You would try that um but but in in General i would say especially with like You know you tend to buy these branded Products for cheaper on like amazon than They would be on the brand site right They tend to run more sales no not Necessarily not with clothing products Because the amazon fees that they have To pay are Are fairly significant as well often you Can find you can get much better deals Going going Okay like clothes is one of those things That i Amazon is not they have not like totally Conquered it yet So at what rate would you switch from Amazon to cj Like let’s say amazon three percent how Much would cj need to be for you to even Consider it Uh six or seven i’d say i mean i’m Considering it from four and a half Kind of onwards i’m experimenting with It i’m maybe Starting with cj from like six or seven Upwards mm-hmm okay cool yeah It is a tough one that’s what that’s
What i’m asking a question if it was an Easy question i wouldn’t ask it Uh obviously your mileage may vary and This is one of these things where like Don’t just say what we said on the but Don’t just take what we said on the Podcast and never try it and then just Do it Um my my guy instinct would still be to Go with amazon Pretty high yeah six percent at least i Would say six seven i think seven would Be at the time where i would switch Um but i would probably try both so it’s Like if i did a round of review i Probably put some cj Or even i’d run one month with one and Then i’d run the next month with the Other and just look at You know how much i made per 100 Visitors or something and then and i’ll Be able to decide based on that it’s not Perfect but it’s like The best way you have there’s not Running There’s another dynamic that i want to Introduce here though because we’re Talking about a pair of shoes which cost I don’t know how much shoes cost either Well 60 to 100 bucks or Nike shoes maybe um but if you If we’re talking about something like Let’s say a 900 mountain bike
Where purchasing it’s not really a Instinctive Like oh i’ll just go you think about it Yeah yeah you know anything that’s Over 100 to 200 like there’s a lot It takes a lot more consideration to Make that purchase Um in which time the 24-hour cookie Flags that amazon have Is likely to to expire or someone else Is going to cookie them So you you may end up in a situation uh Where you you miss out just because People are thinking about it maybe they Come back next week Read another review check that out but If you If you have a cj program with a 30-day Cookie And that pays seven percent on mountain Bikes then In that case um i would i’d be More heavily leaning towards that as the The first option So for the mountain bike what percentage Of cj do we place amazon let’s say Amazon’s three percent still Honestly quite close like maybe like Four percent Honestly i was gonna say four point five Yeah maybe maybe even the same like Three percent The the purchasing window might be that Significant
Um i don’t know yeah it’s probably Around the same three percent i would Stay i would say probably amazon still Wins But the thing that you get from this as Well is that these websites they run Retargeting as well right so it’s like People go and check the bike And it’s gonna not only you get paid for 30 days but they’re essentially Running a campaign for you to get paid Your commission for 30 days Uh to these people who showed interest So it’s like Yeah maybe maybe four percent 4.5 yeah i Would say around that but again These are like based on experience but Kind of like gut feeling Not tests and you should try it try it For one month with one Then try it for the next ones with the Other and and try to decipher it’s quite Interesting because you will often find The same product across multiple options Um and actually the next one i wanted to Introduce was Network versus in-house affair program Which because that happens as well for Example Uh like there was there’s um there’s Some vpn companies for example that are Both On networks and running their own Affiliate programs
And they tend to be a bit different Terms and condition as well right some Of them would maybe offer you Uh recurring through the in-house And maybe you run off through the Affiliate through the affiliate network Or something Uh and so you you kind of like go and Shop here Um but even with Sometimes when the f3 program has the Same payout I was reading a lot of tests from guys Who do ppc because it’s much easier for Them to test you know People make 30 to 40 percent more money By just finding By just testing these even though they Have the same uh payout so it’s like Uh i was reading about that guy and um And he switched he tested the Cj i think and he tested the in-house Affair program and One of the tracking domains loaded Faster like the cj a little bit faster Something like this Than the um and so like because people Didn’t drop out He made like 20 or 30 more money um Because essentially it was a better Experience even though it was leading to The exact same place in the end The same sales page the same everything Just through different ways so
It’s one of these things where i like to Introduce pop-ups Um i like to do so i do test with Pop-ups so i can do a Let’s say you have a random preview Right let’s say you’re doing blenders Okay let’s go let’s go for blenders Uh and then you what i do is like It’s like best blender you rank for that And People who go on that page i put an exit Pop-up or mobile i’ll put maybe like a 15 second after page load pop up Where it just shows hey save 20 Or whatever the offer you have from your Offer on that blender click here to get It right and it’s like You make some sales from that and Because many pop-up systems we use Opt-in monster but you could There’s many of them like thrive leads You can do that perfectly fine and just Play a one-off Um you can run the a b testing on Pop-ups but you don’t really care about The result of the a b testing from the Pop-up tool You actually care about the earnings From the offer behind so you just make a Button one You make the exact same problem one Linking to cj the one linking to the In-house affiliate program And you just run that for 30 days so
It’s exactly splitting half half And you just check literally how much Money you made and your epc from that And you will like i’ve seen several Tests on forums et cetera We haven’t run into that specific Situations ourselves so that’s why i’m I’m quoting these things um i’ve seen Situations where people would make 20 to 30 percent more money with the exact Same payout Um so it’s quite interesting and even if You find Two avenues for the same thing you might Want to test it and you might end up Making more money It might be worth it if you get enough Volume i think The reasoning or some of the reasoning For that Potentially could be down to the Underlying technology So i presume commission junctions uh Technology is Is really on point i mean they they Probably have a big job right Works on making this like just flawless Uh now we don’t know in that that Situation what the in-house program was Was using technology wise maybe they Were using like a wordpress plugin like Wp affiliate or something which is fine Like It works to an extent but it’s not
Designed for that kind of like high Level Use and it’s not fully optimized and Tweaked the performance settings are Probably Not as great as um what what cj have Have developed on the flip side of that I think that there can be instances Where an in-house Affiliate program which is tied to a Shopping cart Like thrive cart the the way they have It sounds better yeah Tracks better just because like it’s It’s in built and it’s not Two systems talking to to each other Which always has the potential of Failure if there’s any kind of Kind of issue but when it’s built into The car it’s like a Native setting basically so Um i i feel like when we switched over i Feel like our affiliates Started making more money um when uh the When we were using the thrive cart um Built in whatnot that’s Quite anecdotal so so don’t Quote me exactly on that could be a Number of factors because we changed a Lot of things at the same time as we As we switched over yeah it’s true these Technical things do matter Um like these little things on checkout And everything and
Uh page load time etc for ecommerce it Matters more than like for Block type affiliate type sites etc so It i can see that Play quite a bit actually i’d also say As well Uh you mentioned about the Retargeting as a as an option when not For For the affiliate but for the vendor Doing retargeting so If we’re referring a mountain bike Customer to them and they’re They land on the checkout page and they Don’t quite buy then The vendor does retargeting retargets That person and then sells them Next tuesday via an ad now depending on How they have the program set up Will depend on whether you get that that Commission or not Um a lot of them like for the authority Hacker affiliate program We have cookie free or yeah cookie free Retargeting So when we’re we’re doing retargeting Ads the initial affiliate Gets the the commission for that um Some programs have like a last touch Model so like the last person to Recommend Or to to cookie yeah but normally it Shouldn’t cancel it right We’ll get not to commission well if they
Don’t have Uh if they if they’re not cooking people Through the ad but I mean they can if they if they if they Retarget or They like use their own affiliate link Then they can overtake it And that’s that’s my point like the with With all of this stuff It’s it’s always open there’s an element Of trust that you have to have with the Other party Right and they can always screw that Screw you over if if they so desire i Remember one case There was a guy in the the dc the Dynamite circle Uh who was an affiliate and there was a Network just Decided that they weren’t gonna work With him anymore and they kept like Fourteen thousand dollars of his unpaid Commissions I’m just like sorry um we’re that that’s It Um which you know that was a kind of Business decision on their part bit Bit bit pretty dodgy if you ask Me but You know who else does that who amazon If you get banned from amazon they keep Your earnings you know oh amazon yeah so That that’s interesting because so so That wasn’t some
That’s if you get banned but i don’t Think he actually did this guy did Anything wrong Yeah it just made sense um i think it Was just a money play but There are some i don’t want to call it Nefarious because but Let’s call it questionable um practices That the The amazon program runs so i forget what It’s called it was was it like Gift gift aid or something like that oh I know which one where If you are purchasing a product on Amazon Um you can opt to Give amazing smiles yeah that was amazon Smiles you can opt to like Give some money to charity as part of it For free Essentially and it’s like well why would You not do that i mean you’re You’re buying something on amazon it Costs the same and you you end up giving One percent of that to the You give yourself to the charity but in Those cases what actually happened was That they would Not allow any affiliates to be eligible For commission When they were doing that now at the Time um When i i sort of noticed this this was When amazon was
More in the sort of like four five six Seven sometimes eight percent commission Um so essentially they were not paying The affiliates Four to eight percent commission and Then paying a charity One percent instead and pocketing the Other Three to seven percent or whatever it Was um which You know not that many people were using Amazon smiles but Still you know these these kinds of Things do go on Even at a kind of a big uh high level Like For a pro network like amazon kind of Makes me happy that bezos is now number Two richest man in the world you know Like this [Laughter] I’m sure i’m sure he’ll be struggling to Sleep at night on his like I know it must be a tough life for him Right now like you must hate it you know Yeah um although aj it just takes a bit Of a tumbling from the tesla stock and Then he’s back to number one so Who knows uh okay anything to add no All right well then we’re gonna close it Here guys thank you for listening If you enjoyed it don’t forget that you Can subscribe on youtube And you can also give us a like if
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